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香格纳画廊推出阿彼察邦·韦拉斯哈古中国首次个展《纪念碑》 2

2017-05-16 15:37:09 来源: 香格纳画廊
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摘要:PART2 与GridthiyaGaweewong的对话 ConversationwithGridthiyaGaweewong GridthiyaGaweewong曾与阿彼察邦在1997年成立了曼谷实验电影节,目前任职于曼谷吉姆·汤普森艺术中心,担任艺术总监 GridthiyaGawe…

PART 2

与Gridthiya Gaweewong的对话

Conversation with Gridthiya Gaweewong

  Gridthiya Gaweewong曾与阿彼察邦在1997年成立了曼谷实验电影节,目前任职于曼谷吉姆·汤普森艺术中心,担任艺术总监

  Gridthiya Gaweewong founded the Bangkok Experimental Film Festival with Apichatpong in 1997, and is currently the Artistic Director of the Jim Thompson Art Center, Bangkok.

阿彼察邦 Apichatpong Weerasethakul, 热室 Fever Room, 2015, 现场图 Installation View, Courtesy Kick the Machine Films

  2016年1月1日

  Khamvongsa酒店,万象,老挝

  GG:当你在创作时什么是使你觉得最快乐的?

  AW:我曾经热衷于发展脚本。拍摄的过程是挺折磨人的,因为它很紧张。最近,自从开始《原始》(一个多平台的作品),我开始试着思考,发展过程和制作成为一件事。制作是更加感应到如何去改变。它很大程度是受影响于艺术——从有所准备到即兴创作。我让我自己走得更远。当我创作《热带疾病》的时候,我真的是一个控制狂。但到拍摄《恋爱症候群》,我开始改变。我想直至现在,我已经改变了很多了。

  GG:你怎么划分自己的作品呢?怎么选择哪一个作品是艺术作品,哪一个是故事片?

  AW: 艺术是一个很宽广的领域。区别是来自于观众的参与。电影作品对观众是非常呵护的。对我来说艺术作品需要观者的记忆和视角来完成的。就像在《烟火》中,观众看作品的视角会跟我不同。艺术作品和电影之间有一些推拉,是艺术家和观众在主动与被动之间的转换。

  GG:但是你的作品并不见得会对观众进行操纵。也许有一些地方会提醒观众“嘿,这是个电影哦。”我觉得你的作品给观众很多自由空间,而不是告诉观众哪里该笑哪里该哭。你的影片里有那么多自由,我没有办法标明那个是艺术哪个是电影。界限被模糊了。

  AW:那是因为你是这种观众。你在看电影的时候不是像个僵尸一样。有时候电影会找到正确的点来触发你,把你启动。不是每个人都这样的。有些人喜欢你握着他的手。这就是为什么电影需要那么多剪辑,这样观众才能忘记镜头,忘记电影的结构。

阿彼察邦《能召回前世的波米叔叔》拍摄现场

  Apichatpong Weerasethakul, Uncle Boonmee Who Can Recall His Past Lives, Shooting Site, Courtesy Kick the Machine Films

  January 1, 2016

  Khamvongsa Hotel ,Vientiane, Laos

  GG: What do you enjoy the most when you are working?

  AW: I used to love developing scripts. The filming process is torturous because it's very stressful. Lately, since working on Primitive (a multi-platform work), I try to think of the developing process and production as the same thing. Production is more responsive to change. It 's greatly influenced by art the readiness to improvise. I let myself go more. When I created Sud Pralad, I was a real monster. But by the time ofSyndrome and a Century, I started to change. I think I've changed a lot up till now.

  GG: How do you divide the work? How do you choose which is a piece of art and which is a feature film?

  AW: Art is a large canvas. It is about the participation of an active audience. Film embraces the viewer. For me, art requires the memories and perspectives of the audience to complete. Like in Fireworks, the audience can see the work from a different perspective than I can. There is a push and pull between art and film, a shift in the activity and passivity of the audience and the filmmaker or artist.

  GG: But your films don't necessarily manipulate the audience. There may be many moments that remind the viewer- hey, this is a movie. I think your films give the audience a lot of freedom rather than telling them when to laugh and when to cry. There is so much freedom in your filming that I can't delineate which is art and which is film. The line is blurred.

  AW:Because you are a particular kind of audience. You don't approach watching like a zombie. Sometimes a film hits you in the right spot and activates you . Not everyone is like that. Some are used to having their hands held. That's why films have somany cuts, so that the audience can forget the frame, forget the mechanics of film.

Courtesy Kick the Machine Films

  与Andrea Lissoni的对话

  Conversation with Andrea Lissoni

  Andrea Lissoni,英国泰特美术馆, 担任高级策展人,负责电影和动态影像的展览以及展示。

  As Senior Curator, International Art (Film), Andrea Lissoni is responsible for exhibitions and displays of film and moving image works at Tate Modern.

  AL:白天与黑夜,光明与黑暗。这些相互抵消又相互作用的元素在阿彼察邦的作品中以一种强烈的方式呈现在观众眼前。它们或平缓或跌宕的交织在一起。你通过燃烧的火焰、烟火,或者是洞穴中的光亮来达到这一效果。这些手法不仅使人们回想起电影的本质和功能,并且也使得历史瞬间得以再现。你是在构想一部电影或是一件装置作品时想到这些吗?

  AW: 我想要强调的是,一个洞穴人试图在黑暗中寻找一种慰藉,通过火与影子获得内心的平静。我们都是如此。我为电影制作着迷,正是由于我对于自然现象的敬畏之情。当我年轻的时候,我难以区分电影与梦境的界限。鬼片中闪动的雷鸣,大洪水,地震,或者镜头下像雨水一般带着划痕的阳光。来自于科幻小说的遐想植根于年轻时的现实生活中。当我制作电影的时候,我深深的着迷于那些简单的光线变化或者破裂。这是一种原初的乐趣。

阿彼察邦《能召回前世的波米叔叔》电影截图,2010

  Apichatpong Weerasethakul, Uncle Boonmee Who Can Recall His Past Lives (still), 2010, Courtesy Kick theMachine Films

  AL:你与艺术的渊源由何而来?

  AW:我从未考虑过将自己置身于艺术的语境当中。我对摄像机以及实验电影有着浓厚的兴趣。泰国的艺术氛围在2000年的时候逐渐活跃起来,我当时参与了一个电影制作项目Project 304,负责策划电影放映以及电影节的活动。正是在这一时期,实验电影开始与视觉以及媒体艺术有了越来越多的交集。它们之间的界限渐渐模糊甚至消失。我着迷于处于这种边界的摄影机的不同使用方式,对我来说,这个边界还在,只不过它变得更加易变和具有流动性。记忆在我的电影制作中也起着重要的作用,因为我将我的作品视为日记。记忆的表达本身也是一种记忆。经历这样一种转变本身就很有趣。

  AL:你之前经常会提及某些艺术家和实验电影制作者(玛雅·黛伦, 安迪·沃霍尔, 布鲁斯·百利…)对你产生了很大的影响。实验电影制作是如何在你的作品中继续占有一席之地的?

  AW: 这些艺术家使用镜头的手法让人为之惊叹。他们的作品有一种媒介上的人为感,时间的人为感。我一直从中深受启发,因为它是(或者不是)一种自我存在的回响。你同样可以将精神和身体也视为是人工的。

  AL: 你是如何看待电影的生存状况?

  AW: 电影胶片这种材料终会消失,这是显而易见的。它的物理性能也是一直处于发展变化当中,从硝酸纤维到醋酸纤维等作为片基的材料,再到胶片的不同尺寸等等。数码是一项巨大的变革,但我相信,如果我们从未来往回看的话,它正在开启一个时代,电影正变得越来越私人化。我们对光的操控越来越接近于与我们的精神以及声音的互动。

Jenjira Pongpas,阿彼察邦的“御用”演员,曾饰演多部艺术家的作品中的重要角色

  Jenjira Pongpas, Apichatpong's regular actor, played several important roles in his works, Courtesy Kick theMachine Films

  AL:Night and day, light and dark. The fading and interplay of these are strongly present in your work and are intertwined either in smooth or abrupt manners. You evoke this through the use of flares and fireworks or within natural environments, such as lightning in caves. These techniques can recall both the cinema, its nature and its apparatus, and the representation of historical moments as well. Do you think of this when conceiving a film or an installation work?

  AW: I empathize with a cave man who seeks comfort in the dark, who is calmed by fire and shadows. We all are. I was drawn to filmmaking because of this awe in natural phenomena. Movies and dreams were hard to distinguish when I was young. Animated flashes of thunder in ghost movies, massive floods, earthquakes, or a shot ofthe sun with scratches as the rain, they are embedded in youth's reality from popular fiction.When I make movies, I am fascinated by simple light change, or disruption. It's aprimal pleasure.

  AL: Where does your relation to art come from?

  AW:I never thought of getting myself into the art context. I was into cameras and experimental film. It was during the early 2000 that Thailand's art scene became active. I was working in film in this collective calledProject 304. I coprogrammed screenings and film festivals. That was a time when experimental film had started to have many crossovers with visual and media artists. Venues intermixed and the borders slowly disappeared. I am interested in the different ways I use the camera in relation to this border, which for me is still there but it's becoming more fluid. Memories are also affected, because I view my work as a diary. The expression of memory is a kind ofmemory. It's interesting to live this transformation.

  AL: In the past you often recalled how certain artists and experimental filmmakers (Maya Deren, Andy Warhol, Bruce Baillie...) were influential for you. How has experimental filmmaking continued to play a part in your work?

  AW: I am amazed by the way these artists use their cameras to look. Their works evoke the artificiality of the medium, of time. I am always inspired by this effect because it echoes the existence (or not) of self. You can look at the mind and the body as artificial as well.

  AL:How do you see the life and the survival of film?

  AW: The actual material, film,will be gone of course. Physically, it has been always in transformation, from nitrate toacetate, from different sizes of film, etc. Digital is a big change but I believe if we look back from the future, it will be an opening of an era when cinema starts to be more personal. Our manipulation of light is getting closer to interacting with our mind, our voices.

  摘自 Reference

  以上谈话节选自阿彼察邦•韦拉斯哈古SOURCEBOOK《狂中之静》,ICI与MAIIAM清迈当代艺术博物馆联合出版,2016年11月

  Conversations were excerpted from Apichatpong Weerasethakul Sourcebook: The Serenity of Madness, edited by Apichatpong Weerasethakul, ICI and MAIIAM Contemporary Art Museum, November 2016.

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